A new motivation

Julie Lorentzen, Head of Division, Department of Management and Communication, Health and Care Administration at Københavns Kommune. Photo by Photo by Jakob Pagel Andersen

Julie Lorentzen, Head of Division, Department of Management and Communication, Health and Care Administration at Københavns Kommune. Photo: Jakob Pagel Andersen

Meeting Egyptian women in leadership positions not only gave Julie Lorentzen a better understanding of life in Egypt. It also made her learn something about herself and her own country.

by Rasmus Boegeskov Larsen

When Julie Lorentzen decided to join Women Take the Lead, she was hoping it would be different from what she had experienced in other networks.

“I was really missing a network that was not limited to the field I work in and was not about furthering your career. In such networks it easily becomes a competition, where people boast about themselves and try to surpass one another. I wanted to find a network that was more focused on learning about each other and about oneself”, says Julie Lorentzen, who works as Head of Division at the Department of Management and Communication at the Health and Care administration in the City of Copenhagen.

In the Women Take the Lead network, organized by the Danish-Egyptian Dialogue Initiative, 20 female leaders from Egypt and Denmark hosted each other in Cairo and Copenhagen. They spent days together visiting workplaces, holding workshops, and discussing wide-ranging issues.

“What I found in the Women Take the Lead network was just what I had been looking for. I don’t think I have ever been in a room where people were so openminded and not judgmental or patronizing. When you expressed an opinion, reflection, or experience, it was not questioned or countered by another opinion. Rather, people listened and asked questions to understand you better. We very quickly built up trust and began sharing things that were difficult and sensitive. It was a very liberating experience”, says Julie Lorentzen.

As the women got to know each other, they realized that they had a lot in common.

“We are faced with many of the same dilemmas as women. For instance, we are met with certain expectations from the society around us. We are asked about starting a family or how you prioritize work in relation to your private life, which are questions men will rarely be asked. As women we often have to legitimize what we choose to do and are automatically expected to act and live in a specific way”, she says.

“What is different is that in Egypt it is more rooted in religion and traditions, whereas in Denmark it is more unspoken. It is a social pressure that we face in family gatherings and job interviews for instance”.

During the workshop the women visited Julie Lorentzen at her workplace, the municipality of Copenhagen. Photo by Jakob Pagel Andersen

Meeting the Egyptian women not only gave Julie Lorentzen a better understanding of life in Egypt, but also made her more aware of how things are in Denmark.

“I always strive to put myself in situations where I am confronted with what is different to me. Not only do you learn from them and get exposed to something new, you also learn a lot about yourself. You start to reflect about all the things in your own life that you take for granted or rarely think about. They get highlighted in the meeting with what is foreign. I got reminded that even though we boast in Denmark that we have a very equal society, we still have a lot to work on. Too often we forget that. We believe that all is good in our country, and that can make us passive.”

“What I found in the Women Take the Lead network was just what I had been looking for. I don’t think I have ever been in a room where people were so openminded and not judgmental or patronizing", Julie Lorentzen said. Photo by Jakob Pagel Andersen

For Julie, it was important to show the Egyptian women that in Denmark not everything is as it appears on the surface.

“Denmark’s image can be very rosy. It is said that we are the happiest people on earth. I felt a need to take that image apart. We are privileged to live in a country with high living standards, limited social classes, and a well-functioning public sector and welfare system. But we still have a long way to go before everyone are treated equally and feels free to do and choose that they want.”, she explains.

According to Julie Lorentzen, having these discussions among Danes can be challenging, because some can’t see the problem. She enjoyed talking about it with the Egyptian women, who might have been surprised by some of what they heard but could easily relate to it.

“It was really nice to be in a setting where you didn’t need to prove how young women are treated differently in the job market. You didn’t need to start the conversation debating whether inequality exists at all. We were in a space where you could talk about what you experience and people would just listen and share their own experiences. I really enjoyed that”, she tells.

This shared understanding allowed the women to quickly move the discussions into a more constructive direction.

“When you bring together twenty young women, you could easily think everything would revolve around criticizing the patriarchy. Of course, we talked about the differences there is between how men and women are treated, but much of the time we actually just talked about how it is to be in this situation, how you can take some steps away from it, and how you can have an impact on it. It was not about complaining and blaming others. Our talks were really constructive”, she says.

When the program had finished and the Egyptians travelled back to Cairo, Julie Lorentzen was left with a new motivation.

“It was really inspiring to be with so many talented and brave women who have each made an effort to promote equality and to break the norms for what a woman can do. It has motivated me to find new ways that I can contribute. Honestly, spending time with the Egyptian women and hearing about their struggles made me a bit ashamed that in Denmark the fight for equality has stalled. We tend to be content with what we got. It was eye-opening to realize how much we still have to work on and how much responsibility we have ourselves to drive that change”, says Julie Lorentzen.